Libertarians for Labour?

There has been a disturbing trend developing in the Liberatarian Blogosphere. Several hitherto level-headed bloggers have seriously suggested that five more years of Labour, five more years of Gordon Brown might not be a bad thing.

Really? Yes, really.

The Salted Slug recently pondered doing the unthinkable, and putting a cross by the Labour candidate. His logic was, in part, that it might:

".. result in Labour having to stay around to answer for their own incompetence (rather than the usual blaming of successive Tory governments when they clean up the mess )"

The Scary Clown has gone one step further, and says he'll be voting Labour. His reason?

"Imagine what havoc would be wreaked upon Labour's credibility if they had to be the party of cuts, the party that actually inherited the consequences of their economic mismanagement? .. The faction fighting and internecine struggles would prevent them from doing any actual governing as well"

Those Daily Mail-reading Libertarians Boatang and  Demetriou also fervently hope that the Tories lose the election. Their logic is, as ever, pitched at other angry sixth-formers, but runs along the same lines:

"4-5 years of Labour or Labour / Lib Dem alliance will fuck the country sufficiently for even the most retarded of morons out there to wake up to the fact lefty, statist type politics fails. 4-5 more years of this will lead to a rampant revival of extremist politics"

To all of which, CF can only respond: What the flying fuck are you on about? Are you fucking mad?

It is a truth universally acknowledged that this woeful government has fully, comprehensively fucked up everything it has touched. Do we really want them to carry on meddling, interfering and ruining the country just so we can prove that they're ... err ... not very good at governing?

Imagine you were renting a house. You'd rented it for nearly thirteen years. The landlord has been dishonest and incompetent. The rent keeps going up and up, and yet no improvements are ever made. In particular, there is a serious electrical fault, which experts have warned you could well result in a major fire if not remedied.

And yet the landlord will do nothing about it. and has refused to acknowledge that there is an issue.

Whenever you challenge the landlord about this - or indeed any other issues - he doesn't attempt to explain, apologise or even justify his behaviour.

He claims that the property has been brilliantly maintained, and that only he is capable of such maintenance. He often speaks for some time about the terrible things that 'other' landlords would do with the property, whilst at the same time doing nothing at all himself.

A chance comes along to move to another house, just down the street. You know it's quite similar, and you don't think the landlord will be substantially different. But at least it will get you away from this dangerous fool.

Do you move? According to the logic espoused by CF's fellow libertarians, no you don't.

You sign up for another five years rent, in the same house with same landlord. And you secretly hope that the electrical fault will get worse, and that one night the house will burn down.

Because that will prove you were right about the landlord, and show everyone else how terrible he is. Aha! Then the landlord will have to 'answer for his own incompetence'. Then the landlord will 'inherit the consequences of his mismanagement'. Then 'even the most retarded of morons' (oh, the poetry of B&D) will realise that the landlord was no good.

Mind you, you'll be sitting in the burnt-out shell of your house, among the ashes of your possessions.

Or, in the case of McDoom and his cronies, in the the burnt-out shell of this country, among the ashes of a once-great nation.

What. The. Fuck?



Jill said...

I don't much like this idea either, although it seems to be gaining currency for some inexplicable reason. Having said that, I don't see that Call Me Dave is offering right libertarians anything more than NuLab is offering left libertarians. It's not a positive vote for either to vote for either, any more than this proposal is.

I saw some comments on Obnoxio's piece arguing for proper positive voting for minority parties (his case LPUK, one assumes) and I probably do agree that this kind of generational, even multi-generational change is what's required to get us out of this stultifying, fag-paper-between-equally-moronic-idiots political quagmire we find ourselves in.

Snowolf said...

I understand the logic, and whilst I'd get some perverse pleasure from seeing NuLab stick around to reap the rewards of their actions, I couldn't do it. I just couldn't.

If there's to be no LPUK candidate down my way (and it doesn't look like there will be), my vote will go to an indie, or I'll spoil my paper in the absence of them.

opinion prole said...

Changing the electoral system or party system can wait. To hell with silly little parties. This is an EMERGENCY. We have to get rid of fucking Labour NOW before they totally and utterly destroy our country. There is simply only one alternative, the Tories, whether you like it or not. The Clown is just showing the early symptoms of Toynbee's disease - listening to leftie bullshit for too many years drives you completely insane.

Anonymous said...

Obo & Slug should get out more. This total fucking disaster will not be sorted out by "moron of the same" Broon and his band of lying cheating self-serving bruised cretins. DING may not be much better, but anyone else will do in these dire circumstances - if you're drowning, grab the rope with less slime on it.

mungle said...

McDoom's ego demands that he be elected, he can then say he has been elected as PM. For that reason alone I could never bring myself to vote labour. Imagine if you can stand it, Brown's gurning grin as he is greeted by a Pravda hack shortly after his victory. As for cleaning up the mess well Brown has always put his ego before party and country, he could retire on the grounds of ill health, leaving some hapless marxist to sort out the mess.

Anonymous said...

A priority must be to vote for and support any candidate who is most likely to unseat a sitting labour MP and to support any candidate who is most likely to keep labour out of a non labour seat. Has to be.

Jonny said...

You're right. They're being utterly absurd.

I've been in marketing and advertising long enough to know that people are incredibly resistant to buying brands they don't know.

Apply that aspect of human nature to politics and you suddenly understand that the only way to make the country go libertarian is to take the existing centre right brand - ie the Conservatives - and convert it fully to the cause of freedom rather than authoritarianism.

This the the Hannan/Carswell approach and it's one with which I heartily concur.

LPUK, on the other hand, simply sucks libertarians out of the only non-socialist party that can win a national election.

Intruder said...

What if you can't change property, but only change the landlord?

Would you keep the bastard who brought the house to ruin so he got the shit from the health inspector, hopefully losing his license? Or would you bring in another landlord in full knowledge that he wont lower the rent or fix anything.

Consider just how much more of this shit people will take before Labour are seen for the utterly incompetent & willfully destructive lying bastards they are.

When Kinnock lost it was such a shock the Labour party reinvented itself as what *everyone* wanted.

If Dave lost, the Conservatives would reinvent themselves as the party of minimalism, with real policies, rather than the wishy-washy 'we cant lose this' non-policies they have now. Perhaps have David Davies as the next prime minister...

Voting conservative might see us alive at the end of this recession, and I guess that's my main concern. A wasted opportunity to actually dismantle the overbearing State though - that's here to stay if Tories get in.

Joe Public said...

"Cutting one's nose to spite one's face"

[But the Clown can just replace his proboscis-cover & no one'd know the difference.]

Jill said...

But Jonny: isn't the point the Hitchens one? Carswell/Hannan are doomed to be fringe members of a centrist, largely statist, Tory Party forever. If they win, it might as well BE Labour. Therefore, the Tories need to implode so that a properly right libertarian party can rise from its ashes. So it's better to vote Labour NOW, and enable/accelerate that process. It's not really about Labour having to clean up its own mess at all, is it? It's about a game that's longer than the next election.

I'm not sure I buy into the idea that a tsunami like that is a) advisable in a rec/depr-ession and b) would work (SDP anyone?) but it's not stupid, or even demonstrably wrong.

I do think politics needs a massive regeneration though, and I am certainly not talking about Westminster troughing. I shall be spoiling my ballot paper with 'none of the above' - and yes, I'm aware of all the arguments against doing that, too.

Anonymous said...

CF, you are correct, Obo, etc. are wrong, very wrong. The thought of Labour fighting the civil service over the required cuts is laughable. At least the conservatives will give it a go; if they fail we are no worse off. Labour are incapable of fixing the problems, look who funds them.

John Pickworth said...

This is an issue that requires cool heads.

I don't want to hammer again the points that I and others have made elsewhere but I just ask that folks look at the bigger picture (there is one).

There is merit in the idea of refusing to play the great government switcheroo. By all means vote independent or other -- or at least tell the pollsters you will -- anything but the heir apparent. Even (choke) Labour is a better option than simply changing tie colour but not the policies.

As someone said recently; the Tories should be 60% ahead in the polls not just a piffling 6%. Clearly not everyone is convinced the Tories have it right, this threat to vote Labour is the very last chance we have to make them see they are on the wrong track. If we don't, its just 5 more years of the same no matter which of the big two win.

Make no mistake, I want rid of Labour but I'd like to believe that once they've gone they're they've gone for good. Short of burning down the Reichstag (can you see us ever doing that?) we need to crush them in other ways. I suggest we give them some more rope and drop them from an even great height.

Charlotte Gore said...

I'm with you, CF. Even if Labour won, it wouldn't be them that get the blame - it'll be the 'free market' and the bankers and the "evil capitalists" and Brown and Balls will together "take measures" to stop them "destroying the country with their greed" and we'll all remember *this* time as a profoundly liberal and free time by comparison.

The first thing that'll happen if Labour win is the UK will get its credit rating downgraded. The only reason its not been already is because people expect a new Government to come in.

Always expect left wing Governments under extreme pressure to swing to insane levels of protectionism, control and propaganda. It's not worth it.

bnzss said...

Don't disagree. I couldn't vote for Labour without projectile vomiting all over the booth.

So I'm giving my vote to an independent, for whatever good that'll do. I just can't stomach doing much else.


"It is a truth universally acknowledged..."

Unfortunately it isn't.

Talk to your workmates, neighbours, even family, The VAST MAJORITY really are falling for the MSM propaganda offensive (Tory Toffs, looking after the wealthy with tax breaks, etc).

That said, I fully agree with Anonymous at 12:54.

Martin S said...

They are playing politics. Toy town revolutionaries.

Jill said...

Can I just say, although I still don't much like this idea, that thousands upon thousands of voters took this exact same decision in 1997, and went with NuLab. It's been a *crushing* disappointment. All you people saying "anyone but Gordon" are the equivalent of all the people who said "anyone but Major" then (although I suppose they really meant Thatcher). This idea is simply saying don't vote BluLab, that's all.

I genuinely think there's a strong argument there, even if I don't agree.

patently said...

So let's bring the country to its knees, in order to prove that Labour always brings the country to its knees.

Yes, it's a stupid argument. But it's a horribly attractive one to stupid people.

After after 13 years, there seem to be plenty of them :-(

I'm worried.

Anonymous said...

To push your landlord analogy a bit further, its as if when you moved the only property available had exactly the same faults and was run by your landlords twin brother.

So there was no point in moving. In fact, if you don't move, the landlords twin may realise that the reason the property is still empty is BECAUSE the property is the same as his evil twin. So by staying there is the possibility that things will change whereas if you move you guarantee nothing will change.

This is how I see the argument, others will view it differently.


Rob F said...

I'll be voting LPUK, or if they're not standing in my area, for UKIP.

Why, if I know that they won't win? Because if enough people vote for the smaller parties rather than for the Tories, it'll send them a message (assuming that they're even listening) that they just aren't addressing people's concerns.

In my case, those concerns are (among others) the EU, the collossal waste of OUR money, and a nanny state so obsessed with our lifestyles that I wouldn't be surprised if the next 'recommended government limit' is about the number of times we're allowed to fart each day.

If everyone follows the lead of Obo and Salty, what message will that send to Ding? That Gordon, shit as he is, must be doing something right?

Fuck that. I refuse to be a party to Gordon's delusions of competence.

Anonymous said...

There is a time for voting UKIP and LPUK. It is when we have a conervative government and want to send them a message. Voting for anyone that lets Labour in (except for Margaret Hodge who is slightly more appealing than Nick Griffin!) makes you partly responsible for any and all disasters that arise.